POLL: WHICH IS MOVING? LIGHT OR CAR?
And Solar angle analysis
July 1 2008I'm having a hard time seeing any motion of this car, and in fact the light seems to be moving across the car. This video does use a cross-fade that isn't there, and it seems the original dimmer light remains while a brighter light shining closer to the car's front adds to and overwhelms it, holding for only one frame (action mode off, 3fps).
8 comments:
I think it's too far out there in guess land to say anything of any consequence.
Watching the video, however, I'm wondering if that's Turcios wandering into Lagasse's frame as Lagasse gets in his car and pulls out.
If you watch you can see someone on one of the south side cameras pulling what appears to be a cart. Around the time of impact you can see this person move off to the right. A few seconds later a person appears in Lagasse's camera.
It could be Turcios.
First comment was me being hasty, BTW. I'm in a bridge-burning mood I guess.
Thanks for commenting, Bob. I'm curious mostly if other feel that car is rolling into the light or is the light moving onto/appearing on the car? I'm a bit stumped actually, but I'm also just moving on anyway.
As for the people on cam observations - Mmmm, don't think so. I'm not sure the spot you speak of, but the person we think is probably Turcios runs into the store. See The Trouble with Turcios. He probably emerges with the small group that comes out the same door a second later. Maybe he goes north instead to the other canopy, but it'd take a few seconds. I don't think it matters. No one can show a video of him running off to the left to the mound prior to impact, that's the point... If you're curous tho, see what the interior cameras show. I can't see him, but haven't tried... meh. Boring.
Cheers, mate.
Ok downloaded the 50meg Citgo video and I've gone through a few possibilities, but my ultimate decision comes down to two things.
1) As the car rolls to a stop, we can clearly see that sunlight is being reflected onto the ceiling of the Citgo
2) When the flash appears on the ceiling at the 9:40:38 mark there is also a significant flash on the car which has now started to move off
It would appear to me that the sunlight is being reflected from the window/paintwork of the moving car.
The light across the face of the entrace at 9:40:37 I find interesting. I think this may be a reflection of the explosion and fireball. It appears two seconds after the shadows in the Single Pump Side camera appear. It could also possibly be a reflection of sunlight from the silver AA77.
1) As the car rolls to a stop, we can clearly see that sunlight is being reflected onto the ceiling of the Citgo
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Yep, basically off the rear wheel well. It's not really a pinpoint reflection to the canopy, but the light is reflected above, steady, at that angle, so I think sun. I wish I knew optics better, but too late, no time now
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2) When the flash appears on the ceiling at the 9:40:38 mark there is also a significant flash on the car which has now started to move off
It would appear to me that the sunlight is being reflected from the window/paintwork of the moving car.
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Hmmm, well it's a different angle from the original "sunlight," although I've found it's at least darn close - so now I'm wondering what that steady light was. Two suns that day? A big fire just off-camera? I dunno, confused...
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The light across the face of the entrace at 9:40:37 I find interesting. I think this may be a reflection of the explosion and fireball. It appears two seconds after the shadows in the Single Pump Side camera appear. It could also possibly be a reflection of sunlight from the silver AA77.
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It lingers I've found for at least 1.5 sec, too long for a flash off a moving plane passing the sweet spot - it also pulses and fades, so it must be the fireball I think, probably direct light (1500 feet distnat is all). There is one frame that's different and could be something else (the first, where it's only light at the top), I'll explain that at some point, it's part of Farmer's thing. It's his one clue I agree with of a north path.
I've watched it again today and I'm 100% certain it's coming from the car.
The first lot of light is coming from the rear alloy wheel. The ceiling surface is actually quite reflective. Watch the truck passing at 9:41:51 - you can see it's entire reflection on the ceiling. I think any shiny or light coloured object would be seen in the ceiling reflection as it moved past.
A bright flash is then clearly seen on the driver side rear window, which is also reflected by the ceiling. It's on both objects at the same time, and give the angle of reflection demonstrated by the moving truck at 9:41:51, and the fact that the rest of the ceiling doesn't light up, it *has* to be coming from the car.
To be honest, my first impression was that it was the reflection from the passing plane. But using a little logic and considering the layout of the station I am completely convinced it's coming from the car.
Move along, nothing to see here :)
Alright, so everyone agrees the light on the ceiling is going there from the car, the question of where it was from before the car is still open. Some have thought it was from the plane, but Farmer and I agree it lines up better with the sun, and I note it comes after the moment of impact. IMO it's either direct sunlight or an indirect reflection of the fireball, but the altitude angles seem to say it'd have to be from up in the air...
So in short, I'm a bit confused, but like Farmer I think it's a side-point, and as you say "Move along, nothing to see here." I was annoyed by my bafflement and hoping to hash it out precisely, but it wasn't easy enough, so... apologies for a drawn-out, pointless line of discussion.
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